“I have the hope” of counting on the support of Lula, declares the Argentine candidate in the race for the command of the United Nations

In an interview with GLOBO, Grossi considered Brazil’s position to defend the choice of a Latin American woman legitimate, but he was optimistic that the process would ultimately benefit her. The Brazilian president has not yet publicly made his preference known, but sources in Brasilia confirm that, so far, Lula supports former Chilean president Michelle Bachelet. “It seems completely legitimate to me that President Lula has clearly expressed his preference for a woman. But I also think that this is an evolving process and I hope that things will move in the right direction, that perhaps this can change,” said the Argentine diplomat.

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Below are the main extracts from the interview:

Why is Brazil important to you in your candidacy for United Nations Secretary-General?

This concerns my entire life in international politics, both as an Argentine diplomat and as an international official. Brazil is the main player in South America and practically the most important in all of Latin America and the Caribbean. He is a global player and, moreover, as an Argentinian, he is the natural partner of my country, in every sense of the word. I belong to the generation that concluded the major agreements with Brazil (including the creation of Mercosur, more than 30 years ago). It shaped me and forms the vision I have to this day. Argentina and Brazil created the Brazilian-Argentine Agency for Accounting and Control of Nuclear Materials (ABACC) (in 1991, to guarantee the peaceful use of nuclear energy in two countries), an innovative system and a model for the world.

I cannot not extrapolate this to the international level. If the time is for Latin America and the Caribbean, I think that Brazil must feel, if not representative, at least very comfortable with whoever occupies the position of General Secretariat (of the UN). In my specific case, I worked with Brazilians in very sensitive areas, such as the question of submarines (nuclear submarine with conventional weapons, already under construction). I had an excellent dialogue with the Brazilian Navy, because we have had a relationship of trust for 40 years.

When I presented myself to the general directorate of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), I had the support of Brazil and when people saw that, they were very impressed. I know the circumstances of this election (for UN leadership) are different. But I also know that every election is a process, it’s a bit like choosing the Pope. There are sequences. At the Conclave, its members move forward and form a consensus. In the case of Antonio Guterres, who had a brilliant election, it was a process. And don’t forget there were seven women (in the running).

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Today, there is enormous pressure for Guterres’ successor to be a woman.

I consider that the fundamental principle of equality between women and men is respected from the moment you have three or four women candidates. After that, it’s a matter of conviction, capacity and political viability. An election is not a space to make a statement on an abstract subject, it is a space to choose a person. If it’s a woman, fantastic. If it’s a man, that’s fantastic. And I say this as someone who has really done a lot, a lot for equality between men and women. When I arrived at the IAEA, the organization had 28% women, today it has 52%. I appointed nuclear engineers, nuclear physicists, I created a dress called Marie Curie for women in the nuclear world. When people talk to me about this topic, sometimes I think: have you seen the things I’ve done? Often people who have done nothing to solve the problem. I am very comfortable and aware of this topic. We must choose the best general secretary.

Be a government candidate Javier Milei could harm his search for support from Brazil Lula…

I would invite people to think from another angle. Many people say that President Milei is anti-multilateralism, but he supports a man who leads a multilateral organization, primarily seeking efficiency. Show that multilateralism can be effective. I am not an employee of the Argentine government and I do not follow the instructions of the Argentine government. The Argentine Ministry of Foreign Affairs honored me, because I am Argentinian, with its support. There are nuances. This is not the same as being a person fully identified with the Argentine government. I am proud of my nomination, which my country will offer me.

In the case of Lula’s Brazil, there is still a preference for it to be a woman.

It seems entirely legitimate to me that President Lula clearly expressed his preference for it to be a woman. But I also think it’s an evolving process, and I hope things move in the right direction, that maybe it can change. In any case, if I have the honor of being secretary general, my opinion on Brazil will be the same.

Do you think you will have the support of countries like Russia And China?

I have to be very careful, but I’m doing very well. I have a fluid dialogue with these countries. Including non-permanent members of the United Nations Security Council. Unlike the other candidates, I work on a sensitive subject, which can be an advantage, but also a disadvantage. I can make a decision that displeases someone, and that can change my position. Some say that when I meet (Vladimir) Putin, it is to have his support in my candidacy for the UN. Well, if that were the case, that would get me into trouble with the West, wouldn’t it? Or if I’m in the White House and they say I’m looking for American support, I might say that could get me in trouble with China and Russia. These are pretty dubious arguments. What I have to do is work, my work is my campaign.

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Getting all the votes is a delicate balance…

It’s a challenge, but it’s not impossible. Take the case of Ukraine, where I maintain a fluid dialogue with (Volodymyr) Zelensky and Putin. Also with Washington and Brussels. We managed to negotiate two ceasefires to avoid a nuclear accident in a combat zone.

Would your program as general secretary be conservative on issues such as gender and climate change?

I come back to what I do here at the agency. I don’t ask people what their genitals are, I choose the best people. I make sure everyone has equal opportunities. I will never name a woman or man by their gender, and that applies to other topics. When we talk about climate change, there are mantras about what to say. If we seek, instead of solving problems, to impose a worldview on half the other side, we will never succeed. My view is that the UN suffers from what I call declarationism. It’s all just statements, but there is another world, the real world. I manage on the basis of equality and efficiency in obtaining results.

The theme of peace and security is a very important topic and many people talk about development and humanitarian issues. Of course, it is important, but we are in a complicated world, in which wars appear and armed conflicts are increasing. The United Nations cannot fail to address this issue.

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Do you believe in climate change?

Yes, but we also need to see the world and the global economy. Address the real issues. I’ll tell you a story. One day I was talking to the Prime Minister of India (Narendra Modi) and he told me that, of course, coal is bad, but in his country 3 million people make a living from the coal industry. It is easy to speak out against coal in European cities, but we must not forget the millions of men and women who make a living from it. We need to look at the world and see what solutions we can come up with. This is not about making statements stigmatizing what is good and what is bad.

Would you be in favor of a reform of the UN Security Council, as advocated by Brazil?